Archive for the “Crafting” Category

This is what I get from believing patch notes.

The following glyphs are not inherently learned, and therefore valid for sales..

  • Might of Ursoc
  • Nature’s Grasp

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With the dissemination of the WoW 6.0.2 PTR patch notes, we now have a first good idea as to what the glyph landscape will look like post-Warlords.

In this first round, we are informed that some glyphs will now become known inherently as you achieve certain levels in-game. In other words, you won’t have to buy a glyph off the AH or make it or have it made in order to learn that glyph. Good news for everyone else, bad news for us.

We made several improvements to the Glyph system. While leveling, characters unlock Glyph slots at several specific levels. However, in order to get glyphs, characters need to visit an Auction House (and potentially pay way more gold than an average character of that level has yet), or know a Scribe from which to request them. To solve this, we’ve made characters learn some Glyphs automatically as they level. Additionally, we now have the ability to make some glyphs exclusive with each other, or require specific specializations.

Source

What this means for you is that all the glyphs in this list will potentially be turned into something called a Charred Glyph. These are worth exactly 50s when the patch drops – which is a pretty good deal considering what you can currently vendor a glyph. for something around 14s.

There’s a far shorter list of glyphs which have an uncertain future. To be honest, this could be a data mining error on WoWHead. Some – according to WoWHead – remain untouched, while some of them just … go away.

My methodology here was simple. I took the list from Blizz, looked them up on WoWHead noted the ID of the glyph, then looked it up on the Beta WoWHead. Easy enough. If you see a flaw in that logic, act accordingly.

So here’s the plan.

  1. Fire sale the glyphs on the list of those going away when the patch drops, stopping at 50s + auction fees.  If the price drops below that threshold, stash the glyphs and sell them for 50s apiece when 6.0.2 drops.
  2. Glyphs on the ‘uncertain’ list will probably go the same route … so it’s probably safe to follow option 1 with them as well. But if you feel that WoWHead is more reliable than Blizzard in this regard, by all means, set them aside or just keep them in your sale rotation, business as usual.

Here’s a couple of lists for you.

Glyphs turning to Charred Glyph

  • Alabaster Shield
  • Ambush
  • Avenging Wrath,
  • Black Ice
  • Blink
  • Bloodthirst
  • Breath of Fire
  • Bull Rush
  • Cat Form
  • Cheap Shot
  • Chimera Shot
  • Dash
  • Dazing Shield
  • Deadly Momentum
  • Death and Decay
  • Death Grip
  • Demon Training
  • Denounce
  • Dispersion
  • Divine Storm
  • Double Jeopardy
  • Drain Life
  • Ember Tap
  • Enraged Speed
  • Entangling Roots
  • Eternal Earth
  • Fade
  • Fae Silence
  • Faerie Fire
  • Fear
  • Ferocious Bite
  • Final Wrath
  • Fists of Fury
  • Flame Shock
  • Flash of Light
  • Fortuitous Spheres
  • Frost Nova
  • Frost Shock
  • Frostfire Bolt
  • Gag Order
  • Healing Touch
  • Healing Wave
  • Healthstone
  • Holy Fire
  • Levitate
  • Liberation
  • Light of Dawn
  • Lightning Shield
  • Long Charge
  • Mana Tea
  • Master Shapeshifter
  • Maul
  • Mending
  • Might of Ursoc
  • Mind Blast
  • Misdirection
  • Nature’s Grasp
  • Omens
  • Pathfinding
  • Penance
  • Polymorph
  • Rapid Rolling
  • Rebirth
  • Recuperate
  • Reflective Shield
  • Rejuvenation
  • Renew
  • Savagery
  • Shield Wall
  • Shifting Presences
  • Siphon Life
  • Slow
  • Smite
  • Spinning Crane Kick
  • Spiritwalker’s Grace
  • Stealth
  • Templar’s Verdict
  • the Executor
  • Thunder
  • Unholy Command

Glyphs with Uncertain Futures

  • Harsh Words
  • Totemic Recall
  • Victory Roll
  • Victory Rush
  • Water Elemental
  • Word of Glory

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I’ve been watching other servers merge get linked and I’ve been kind of curious as to how the linking affects their economy. Starting this Thursday, Alleria, a high-pop server (my home) is linking to Khadgar, a low-pop server.

Some of the comments I’ve seen from low-pop servers (and one medium-pop) indicate that there are lot of "makers" but very few "takers", keeping prices low and sales flat. Here on Alleria, even common commodities like herbs can sell out, prices can get a bit up there, and things generally do move.  Even at that, our prices on Alleria have been historically below the average for all realms1.

My own business has been brisk.  I generally can’t keep the shelves fully stocked, I’m always playing catch-up.  On average I pull in 25,000 GP a week. The glyph business has, surprisingly, remained a decent source of income, especially since Blizzcon2.

So what happens when Khadgar’s population gets to taste these waters? That … is the great unknown. Will they inundate us with an oversupply of all things? Will they be starved for goods? Will my counterpart on Khadgar be a total jerk, intent on driving me out of business?3

It’s all, at this point, rather exciting, from a glyph market geek point of view. My *hopes* are that it will be positive.  I might even get to bring some glyphs out of retirement if prices pick up. But even if it goes the other way, I could take at least 25-50% market depression and still get along fine.

In a few days I’ll follow up, allowing things to stabilize – probably after the weekend.


  1. Thanks, TUJ Realm-specific addon! []
  2. I guess peeps are genuinely excited by things to come. []
  3. For the record, that’s been tried before. Go for it. I am Asia. Bring the land war. []

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One of the benefits of having multiple max level toons on the team is that each contributes in his or her own special way.  I make flasks and potions, and do transmutes for sale.  Illume makes glyphs for sale and our own use.  Jas runs the auctions and provides bags.  Each of us provide armor and weapons as we can make them.

Illume has some pretty sweet items in her bag of tricks -  the fan is already mine, but the staff requires Spirits of Harmony, an item you can’t just go buy or mail to an alt. 

So, what to do other than start grinding with the mage and get her inventory full of Spirits.  The goal is to get her to 90, then get her grinding the Tillers so she can plant songbells. This will keep things moving along for future stuff as well.

The point of this is to get my iLevel up to where I can queue for things like daily heroic scenarios and stuff. I’ve been grinding the Darkspear weekly when it makes sense, but weapons are not part of the rewards, alas.

It’s kinda weird going at it from two fronts like that, but whatever works, works.

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After close to two months off the grid, this is what I returned to

Shattered Glyph Market

This is the downside of using mailboxes to keep your stuff organized between you and various mules; anything not in bags evaporated into the Twisted Nether.

On the bright side, my nemesis appears to have disappeared again, and glyph prices are up from where they were when I left. I’m guessing that the number of glyph mongers have decreased faster than the server population as a whole.

Well, off to rebuild.  Has anyone seen the ‘Open’ sign?  It’s under this stuff somewhere …

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In which Actual Numbers are used to derive Actual Conclusions. Accept no substitutes.

I mentioned a while back that I didn’t trust WoWHead’s numbers on pigment yields from herbs, based on a few things.

  1. Uploads from the collection tool don’t seem to be applied in real time.
  2. There is no indication as to how often stale data is purged,
  3. … or how old is considered stale
  4. No indication as to how much of that data is from Beta, and thus no confidence in whether the data was from artificially inflated yield rates1

I also mentioned at the time that I had created an addon that would grab milling data automatically in order to obtain an alternative set of numbers that would be – to me -  unimpeachable.

The downside to this is that I could not trust the numbers I saw until I had more samples.  I think I have enough – for MoP herbs – to provide some more or less accurate commentary, which I present forthwith.

Pigment yields, raw numbers

As you probably know, there are two types of pigments yielded – common (for Ink of Dreams), and rare (for Starlight Ink).  The former is for the mundane stuff such as glyphs, the latter for the rare and epic items, quite often cards for Darkmoon decks.  So there are two thing to consider when obtaining inks to mill – what are you looking for, and what are you going to do with it?

For the average glyph monger, high yield of common inks and low cost (if buying) are key factors.  For Darkmoon Card makers, high yield of rare inks will be the overriding concern.

Common Pigment Yields

As you can see, common inks are largely clustered around the 2.5 per mill mark.  Fool’s Cap far outstrips that at 2.84 per mill. So if other factors are the same, Fool’s Cap is the way to go.  Otherwise any of the other herbs except for Desecrated Herbs are equally good. Desecrated Herbs are probably going to be overpriced, but if they aren’t, they’re marginally better than others.

Rare Pigment Yields

Rare pigments have a similar story, with most clustered around one pigment per four mills, or 0.25. Fool’s Cap again is crazy large at more than one per every other grind, but the price may make it unfeasible.  However, given it’s close to 3-to-1 superiority to the others, a bit of flexibility on the price is warranted. Even at double the price of the others, its yields make it more profitable.

Again, Desecrated Herbs have a marginally higher yield rate than the others, but not high enough to justify a premium price.

The clear winner here is Fool’s Cap, with its tremendous yields of both pigment types. You can justify quite a lot of time farming or money on the AH in order to obtain stacks of this herb. This is especially true if you are after rare inks – the other herbs don’t hold a candle to it.


  1. It’s possible, in order to get more iterations, that node spawns as well as milling yields were tweaked in beta. I have no evidence that that is the case, but I have to consider the possibility when it comes to working numbers. []

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The planned new training recipes for Blacksmithing in patch 5.2 make me sad.

Lemme splain.

In a nutshell, these new recipes can be used to get you from skill level 1 to 500 by using Ghost Iron – I’m going to assume that in the next expansion, it will be the ore of the new lands, perpetually from 5.2 on out.

The good news of this is that you don’t have to go farming for copper, tin, iron, and so forth to get you through the lower levels.

But here’s the thing; can I see a show of hands of anyone that felt that farming or buying copper ore was any more difficult than farming or buying ghost iron?  It’s not difficult. It’s not a problem.  The greatest challenge it poses is for you to figure out what zone has what ores, which is just the sort of brain-dead activity that separates us from lower primates.

In short, this solves a problem that doesn’t exist.

It is strangely similar to how Blizzard solved “the leveling problem”.  Instead of making it interesting, they made it trivial.

And GhostCrawler has the nerve to be surprised that his playerbase “optimizes for efficiency.”

The simplified leveling model solved a problem that didn’t exist. The new blacksmithing scheme does as well.  And both are a monumental waste of time.

If they decide to trivialize the leveling or blacksmithing experience so that it’s just stupid simple to do, why not do something a lot less complicated?  Just let people buy level 85 characters for fifty bucks (and kill the illicit market for said toons).  Just let people pay a huge sum of gold for BS skill level 500 and stop clogging our zones with farmers.

They have a moral and philosophical objection to this sort of thing, but because of those peccadillos, they’ve wasted countless man-hours on something that nobody wants, instead of, oh, I don’t know, new content maybe?. Maybe finish up dance studio? Maybe get those updated models out there?

No, what they’ve decided to do is to give us ways to skip parts of the game without actually and factually doing the deed.

And that, my friends, is disappoint.

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In the “goblin” world, there are goblins, and there are those that write about goblins, and there are those of us that more or less peer in from the edges, bemused at how far one person will go to make a few gold pieces.  I fancy myself in the latter, no illusions there, but I wonder where WpW Insider’s resident goblin journo places himself?

His topic of the day was something near to my heart, inscription as a money maker.  As usual, he almost gets it right, or almost gets it wrong, but doesn’t really nail either.

Buy the Numbers

The first thing I want to tackle isn’t provably wrong – not yet, or at least not provable by me – but I want to shed some light on the statement that possibly was edited down for brevity.1

Assuming you can make a full deck for every 12 cards you produce (which is the ratio you see if you trade really well and/or produce a lot of cards), it’ll cost you 120 stacks of any herb but Fool’s Cap, or 75 stacks of Fool’s Cap. At 40g per stack of, for example, Green Tea Leaf, that’s 4800g per deck. Some decks can sell for over 20,000g.

What’s he talking about, Fool’s Cap requiring fewer stacks?  Well, basically, what he’s saying here is that Fool’s Cap yields up more Misty Pigment than other herbs do.  If he got his numbers from WoWHead, I do question them – WoWHead does not appear to purge old data that often, so the numbers up there could possibly include Beta data.  Hard to say, since they’ve become less transparent by the day.2

However, I wrote a little addon that has been tracking all milling I do in real time.  So far, the yields look like this.3

MoP Herb Yields 2012-12-28

So, everything hovers around the .25-pigments-per-mill level, except for Fool’s Cap, which has yielded around .60.  Yes, that’s more than double, which is in excess of WoWHead’s numbers.  I have no idea whether this will hold, but I’ll be monitoring it.  Right now, I don’t have enough samples from all herb types to make me comfortable publishing a link to the database, but before too long I will.

The upshot is, yeah, right now it’s worth it to buy Fool’s Cap for purposes of making Darkmoon cards.  But now that Euripides has let the cat out of the bag, I expect there to be at least a window in which it will be priced beyond reason.  Keep your eyes on the prices.

Don’t Believe it

Glyphs are a whole other beast. I’ve said a few times that this market isn’t worth pursuing, and to some extent, this still holds true. The main reason I’d advise against trying your hand at the glyph market is that everyone else disagrees with me, and that the profit per hour in this market is purely driven by competitors’ willingness to spend more time cancelling and relisting.

This shows some old-fashioned thinking on Euripides’ part.  The “work harder not smarter” attitude works, if you have no other interest in this game than to sell things and make gold. I’ve other things to do. This is and has been a side-project, in which I attempted to determine if one could make money on the AH in an intelligent way.  I’ve succeeded – if you disagree, it can only be on the matter as to what degree I’ve succeeded.  However, since I started this exercise in Wrath, I’ve accumulated over 1,000,000 gold, so I think I’m on solid ground here.

I published my methods here, so I won’t go into great detail now, but essentially these principles held, and still hold.

  1. Treat the enterprise as you would a retail outlet.
  2. Maintain a working inventory of glyphs.
  3. Cultivate a reliable, inexpensive source of materials.
  4. Rotate stuff out when its price drops too far (as opposed to a forced reset, which is too labor-intensive) and shelve stuff that doesn’t sell at all.
  5. Don’t worry about Euripides and the goblins.

#5 is the part that flies in the face of what Euripides said. He maintains that you have to undercut like a fiend.  I don’t. I sold 5000 GP worth of glyphs last night.  Does that sound like a good turnaround for an hour’s work? It does to me.  I post ONCE per day. I still sell stuff. There are a variety of reasons, but the biggest reason is that the stuff that sells, will sell.  Some “goblin” may undercut me, but if the glyph is a seller, then his glyphs WILL be bought, then mine are right there for the next buyer.

Don’t take the advice of trolls

I like angry letters, so when I have time to troll my esteemed competitors, I’ll go and post a "glyph wall" of 3 of each glyph for triple the materials cost. This is just expensive enough that it’s not worth them buying me out, and cuts the high end of the market (the 300g glyphs that cost 15g to make) out from under them. This can be fun, not unlike popping bubble wrap. I still get undercut within an hour, but since this doesn’t really drive demand up that much, I don’t end up selling anything more than I would have at the high prices. That’s generally when they’ll mail me letting me know this.

In the end, though, I can’t spend all day trolling — they just wait for me to have better things to do and then go back to their old ways.

I encounter a number of idiots like this on my server4 and I always get the last laugh, because while they’re all wrapped up in this little game of theirs, I just keep posting and selling.  They were thick as fleas on a camel when the expansion posted, but they’re gone now, and I an still making bank.  Laugh-a while you can, monkey-boy.

If you’re going to disregard my advice and try to get into the glyph market, the best advice I have for you is to make sure you have the most efficient possible setup, and undercut really frequently.

If you want to make money making glyphs, and you don’t want it to be your life, then disregard this advice and reflect on the article I linked above.  Exercise patience and intelligence5 and you’ll not want for gold in days to come.

Moving on

I’ve a couple more tweaks to make to see how far I can push this thing, but now that I’ve gotten my Million, it’s all become rather pointless. I’m not one of those one-percenters that digs the money just for being the money. My goal has been to provide a comfortable nest egg for ten toons on this server, and I’ve more than accomplished my goal. Anything else is just gravy.

Everybody loves gravy.


  1. Or uberness. One never knows. []
  2. Doesn’t mean I’m going to wax poetic about WoWDB any time soon. []
  3. Green = common yields, Slate = rare yields. []
  4. And yes, that’s a direct Euripides quote, and yes, I just called him an idiot. It’s justified. Trolls are idiots. []
  5. No comment. []

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As treasurer for the clan on the Alleria server, it is my job to disburse and otherwise account for all gold made by the team.  Our goal early on was to ensure a comfortable living wage for all alts in the clan, ensure nobody ever wanted for an enchant, mount, or training session when needed, and to someday reach the lofty goal of one million gold sovereigns.

one millyun

So, yeah, that’s a thing.1

The addon that shows all the alts’ monies for us is, by the way, Broker_Currency, an LDB addon that manages a few things about currencies, such as showing them on the LDB display bar (ChocolateBar in this case), making a drop-down showing all of a particular currency type for all alts on the server, showing certain currencies when you have bags open, and so forth.  This isn’t just money, it’s also things like cooking awards, faction tokens, and so forth. Basically, if Blizz calls it a currency, you can display it in a number of ways for convenience.

We’re all very sad that the original Grimmtooth can’t be here to appreciate the moment. He started the project in WotLK, and would have appreciated its completion.  He’d also appreciate having access to a million gold since there is a sweeeeet gun that pops up on the BMAH, and he could really use it right now. Unfortunately, no way to transfer money between here and Azuremyst, so he’s going to have to work his dwarven butt off to get it.

There are many ways to 1000000 gold. Our approach was to run a glyph shop.  I did the gathering, when needed.  Illume did the crafting. Jasra handled sales of glyphs and all other items that we found, made, or otherwise acquired.  We went for slow and steady, and it has worked quite well. Nobody in the group wants for anything. And we still exceeded the goal, though not as quickly as expected.2

I’m not sure what we’ll do now. The Glyph Store thing has become its own little mini-game. Illume’s number-crunching on prices, availability, and sales patterns are absolutely fascinating. Things like, WHO IS KILLING THE MARKET?  Answer: look who wasn’t here when prices improved.  That sort of thing. Nothing that will help in a raid, but when somebody in guild chat says GEE MY LUCK ON MISTY PIGMENT SUCKS, it’s nice to be able to say, “Well, based on a sample of thousands of mills, all herbs except XXX have a less than 1-per-stack for that pigment. So focus on milling XXX.”3

We’ve been looking at the Enchanting market.  It’s a lot more volatile than glyphs.  But some of the enchants appear to bring some sweet rewards on the AH.

Tedious and boring details will be published when appropriate. Fairly warned be ye, say I.


  1. Don’t be fooled. “Grimmtooth” here is not the homicidal dwarf hunter we’ve all come to love.  He’s a baby gnome warlock that keeps the name from being taken should Grimm the First ever decide to return to his homeland. NOT that that’s been on his mind, but we like to keep our options open. []
  2. Sales fell by over 80% after that post.  But the bottom line is, it was still profitable. Just not headline-worthy. []
  3. Right now, XXX appears to be Desecrated Herb and Fool’s Cap.  Though I hasten to point out that WoWHead’s numbers are much higher for other herbs than actual results obtained during actual milling. []

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Heads up, everybody!

It’s the other shoe that didn’t drop when 5.0.4 came out.  Blackfallow Ink has gotten its pink slip:

Beginning after the maintenance on Tuesday, October 9, ink traders will be converting from accepting Blackfallow Ink to accepting Ink of Dreams and Starlight Ink will become available for purchase. If you’re still holding on to your Blackfallow Ink, your time to trade it in is running short.

– Nethaera

You’ve got until you log out tonight (ish) to resolve your Blackfallow Ink issues.  Actually, this is an unexpected courtesy. Ink of the Sea got ditched without warning when 4.0.3 went live, so I was expecting much the same this time around.

The good news is this: if you have leftover herbs or Blackfallow inks, you an cash those in for Ink of the Sea now, and still blow through them in no time if your server’s like mine.  Ink of the Sea is still the highest-demand ink out there, so you really can’t have too much of it.

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